Talk:Gertrude Stein

Goals of this article

Anyone wanting to know about Gertrude Stein's childhood, education, or what she liked for dinner, is welcome to hop over to Wikipedia and find it out there. They'll also have a list of the famous writers and artists who attended her salon, and fill you in on her personal life, including her sexual orientation (as if that has anything to do with anything literary). But I have focused here on the widespread difficulty people have in reading Stein: they simply don't know what to make of what she wrote. This phenomenon is so strong that even English literature majors in college have often never been required to read a single work by Stein. Stein is the most talked about and least read writer in the English language, a very curious phenomenon, and the reasons for that deserve looking at.

I think this article does need to include some of the other famous quotes attributed to Stein, including "Rose is a rose is a rose". And so it's not done yet. And anyone is welcome to contribute to the article or comment here. Just don't let's duplicate what already exists in Wikipedia. I could read that entire article in Wikipedia without even getting a clue about why she is important in English literature. If indeed she is.Pat Palmer (talk) 03:24, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Since writing the above, the article's focus has shifted to the quotes and their use without specific source citations, out of context, and often misunderstood. And also to clarify briefly that, despite the difficulty in reading her works, she does seem to have been a very original thinker who wanted to shatter people out of the complacency, especially regarding language, and perhaps even, to prove the inefficacy of language as a reliable means of communication for most people.Pat Palmer (talk) 18:52, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

Mulling the treatment of "personal opinions"

A user just today cited some of this article as being "personal opinion", which it probably is, and I am considering whether or how to change it. In the meantime, since this is a signed article, I have restored the deleted sections while I am thinking about how they might be modified but still (possibly) provide useful information. My thanks to Pradyumna Singh for having read through the article and left feedback. Pat Palmer (talk) 19:13, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

I think it's reasonable to claim that Four in America is Stein's least famous work. It is virtually unknown and difficult to find, and almost unreadable when found (as noted in the article), but it's introduction by playwrite Thornton Wilder is a true gem. Also, it does contain that one frequently misquoted line about Grant and tears! However, I am working on the verbiage around this section to try and make it less objectionable and more objective. Suggestions welcome here.Pat Palmer (talk) 19:23, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

FYI, This is not a signed article [1]. Pradyumna Singh (talk) 19:40, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

You are technically correct. Thanks for that. However, I am identified on the article as the lead author. I was confused about what a signed article is. I'll look into this more.Pat Palmer (talk) 20:06, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

as yet uncited phrases to be added to quotes section if exact source can be located

From Everybody's Autobiography, Ch. II, page 75, by Gertrude Stein (1937). |}

It takes a heap of loafing to write a book. From ?, page ?, by Gertrude Stein (19??).

An audience is always warming but it must never be necessary to your work. From ?, page ?, by Gertrude Stein (19??).

A writer should write with his eyes and a painter paint with his ears. From ?, page ?, by Gertrude Stein (19??).

There ain't no answer. There ain't gonna be any answer. There never has been an answer. There's your answer. From ?, page ?, by Gertrude Stein (19??).

only important difference between men and animals

In more than one place, Stein insisted that "money" was the only difference between "men" and "animals". I'd like to work it into the article eventually. Here's one place that she discussed money and mentioned the contrast with animals:

About every once in so often there is a movement to do away with money. Roosevelt tries to spend so much that perhaps money will not exist, communists try to live without money but it never lasts because if you live without money you have to do as the animals do live on what you find each day and that is just the difference the minute you do not do that you have to have money and so everybody has to make up their mind if money is money or if money isn't money and sooner or later they always do decide that money is money.

- p 49 or so, G. Stein 'Everybody's Autobiography'