Talk:Roast turkey

Roast turkey

Current talk page

1, 2

Move to subpage

Requesting Page Deletion

Requesting page deletion as article does not fit Citizendium standards. Mary Ash 04:15, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Impetuous; don't delete - you worked hard on the content, which should be integrated elsewhere. Aleta Curry 05:08, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

That didn't work with Marian apparitions, and I hope it won't work here. The information just needs to be put in the right place, not deleted. David Finn 06:36, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Mary, you should already know that requesting to delete this page is not what is to be done. Thus I have moved the page to the /Recipes subpage.

You have put much effort into this page and collected material, but it needs more work to shape it into a good recipes page. So, please, do not just leave it behind but continue to work on it (with the help of the community). You may take your time, of course -- there is no deadline to meet!

--Peter Schmitt 08:59, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

No, Peter I did not know that an author could request a page deletion. How do you request a page be deleted? I plan no more work on this article as it does not meet Citizendium standards. The one thing I learned in life, so far, is to know when to cut your losses. I am moving onto to other articles to write. Again, how do you request a page deletion? I searched Citizendium and could find nothing to enlighten me on this subject. Thanks!Mary Ash 14:39, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps you should re-read what Peter has written - he said requesting page deletion was not what is to be done.

Oh, and if you want to know how to request deletion of a page, ask the person who placed the speedy delete tag on the article. Speedy delete tags are how you do it. David Finn 14:56, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

David I AM the person who requested the speedy delete and it was refused.Mary Ash 15:05, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

(undent) In any event, the page deletion criteria for non-Editors are restricted to those that are listed for Constables on their own authority. Editors have more, but still restricted categories. Given the number of people who have worked on content here, it is not plausible to say the article is not appropriate for Citizendium. It is being reworked, however, into a style more consistent with that of other food articles on Citizendium. Howard C. Berkowitz 20:54, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Title Change to Roast turkey

Requesting title change to Roast turkey. The current title is inaccurate as roast turkey is eaten worldwide. As shown the British have been eating roast turkey back in the time of King Henry VIII and is still eaten today. The directions for preparing a roast turkey could be used by anyone, in any country, at any time, especially since the metric and Gas Mark measurements are now included.Mary Ash 14:52, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Section move needed

Turkey factoids should be at turkey (bird). The section also needs to be reviewed as people have time and better sources cited as the one used is very general. Aleta Curry 20:37, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough. I'll move them. My opinions about factoids are mixed, but I didn't want to lose them and they were rather lonely on the recipes page. Howard C. Berkowitz 20:54, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Oops! Cross post. Howard, I've moved them, see below. Aleta Curry 20:59, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

'Turkey Factoids' Moved to domestic turkey

I've moved this section to the stub domestic turkey. I had started that without metadata deliberately, pending the conclusion of the great turkey debates. So, that can very easily be cut/moved/deleted/pasted somewhere else, whatever is finally decided. I'm not making any determinations what that should be, only that the factoids shouldn't be at roast turkey. Aleta Curry 20:54, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

text box

Howard, I dunno what you're trying to do, or how to fix it. So let's leave the quotation as it is until we find a guru who can do it. Thanks.Hayford Peirce 21:31, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

OK, I'll comment it out for now and make it a quotation. It didn't belong as a major subhead. Howard C. Berkowitz 21:34, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, it sure doesn't belong where you have stuck it now, either, right in the middle of something else entirely, with absolutely no explanation of what it's doing there. Hayford Peirce 21:50, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

I think it's very much in context. It makes a transition from the small turkeys of the past to the industrial of today.

As a matter of personal style, while I'm fine with lighthearted content, headers are for information indexing or retrieval. Put the lighthearted into the body of text, into a text box (probably preferred) or quotation when it is a quotation. Howard C. Berkowitz 22:01, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Turkey and all that

I try to recapitulate:

1. Mary creates Roast turkey -- a how-to page
2. Hayford considers the page as ethnocentric and moves it to Roast turkey (American) -- obviously he considers such a page title as justified
3. Mary adds more recipes
4. The talk page shows: most agree that this belongs on a subpage
5. Mary requests to delete both the page and the talk page
6. I (and others) point out that deleting is not justified
7. I move the page to Roast turkey (American)/Recipes and -- to avoid an empty main page -- I write a one-sentence lead.
8. I move the no longer current talk page to an archive.
9. Hayford now considers the page as no longer ethnocentric
10. Instead of developing an American-centered page (the recipes are still ethnocentric!), Hayford changes his mind and wants to move the cluster back.
11. Since this does not work immediately, and instead of making room for the move, he is impatient and copies main page and talk page to the intended name and requests to delete these pages
12. Howard objects, and I object because this would destroy the history of the pages and would leave the subpage and the talk page archive orphaned
13. Hayford copies the Recipes subpage, as well.
14. After that, the copies are changed as well, so that they have a history of their own

In addition, we have turkey (bird), turkey dinner, and domestic turkey. Don't forget Wild Turkey which should be bourbon. Aleta Curry 00:14, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Before continuing to develop turkey-related content it is necessary to find an agreement: What pages should exist, and what should be their content?

• From what I have learned from American movies and literature, a page on American roast turkey seems to be justified
• Obviously, a more general page should exist, too. Perhaps turkey (fowl) for culinary issues parallel to turkey (bird).
• Should there be a Roast turkey (international), too? domestic turkey?

I believe firmly in preserving the history of articles. When there is agreement on titles and corresponding content we shall have to decide where to archive what currently exists.

Comments? --Peter Schmitt 23:46, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Howard is too chicken to continue this discussion and ducks out. Just crow when the rest of you have decided. I have been accused of being birdbrained when roasting turkey and probably have little to contribute. Howard C. Berkowitz 23:54, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Aleta doesn't remember actually having been called a turkey - certainly not recently, but I have no stake in roast turkey. I am completely open-minded about turkey clusters. Aleta Curry 00:14, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Turkey clusters? Pieces of turkey stuck together and covered with chocolate? Howard knows about turkey mole, but that's the extent of his turkey-chocolate experience.

(undent) Again, let me know which pages to delete and which to merge. This is not going to be easy, I'm sure. D. Matt Innis 16:07, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Recipes

The Recipes subpage needs heavy revision -- whether as subpage of this article or another. --Peter Schmitt 23:50, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Factoids

The "factoids" were copied from one or two websites. They cannot be considered as reliable "facts" without further research. --Peter Schmitt 23:53, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. I've moved them temporarily, you may already have noticed, if not, please see above. Aleta Curry 00:15, 17 October 2010 (UTC)