Talk:Idée fixe: Difference between revisions

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imported>John R. Brews
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imported>John R. Brews
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:::But which came first, and is one derived from the other? [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] 10:23, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
:::But which came first, and is one derived from the other? [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] 10:23, 8 August 2011 (UTC)


The use in literature goes a long way back, and I'd guess predates the musical usage, apparently which began with Berlioz as you mention as an example. It also is called a ''leitmotif'' apparently. See [this http://books.google.com/books?id=5ln0AAAAMAAJ&pg=PA116&dq=music+%22idee+fixe%22&hl=en&ei=K-o_TuCTGeTJsQKfy8WUDg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEkQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=music%20%22idee%20fixe%22&f=false]. This term also shows up as a [http://books.google.com/books?id=Hn-xjyirP08C&pg=PA52&dq=leitmotif&hl=en&ei=POs_TrKKKuv9sQKU8Ng9&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=leitmotif&f=false device used in poetry]. However, I've made no attempt to look into the history of the musical usage. [[User:John R. Brews|John R. Brews]] 13:33, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
The use in literature goes a long way back, and I'd guess predates the musical usage, apparently which began with Berlioz as you mention as an example. It also is called a ''leitmotif'' apparently. See [http://books.google.com/books?id=5ln0AAAAMAAJ&pg=PA116&dq=music+%22idee+fixe%22&hl=en&ei=K-o_TuCTGeTJsQKfy8WUDg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEkQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=music%20%22idee%20fixe%22&f=false this]. This term also shows up as a [http://books.google.com/books?id=Hn-xjyirP08C&pg=PA52&dq=leitmotif&hl=en&ei=POs_TrKKKuv9sQKU8Ng9&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=leitmotif&f=false device used in poetry]. However, I've made no attempt to look into the history of the musical usage. [[User:John R. Brews|John R. Brews]] 13:33, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

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 Definition:  A preoccupation of mind held so firmly as to resist any attempt to modify it, a fixation [d] [e]
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Origin

This article is a copy of an article of the same name written by myself for Wikipedia Sept-Oct 2010. John R. Brews 18:01, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

The term is also used in musical contexts, to refer to a recurring theme, e.g. in Berlioz' Symphonie Fantastique. I don't know what the relation is between these uses. Peter Jackson 14:00, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
Hi Peter: The term idée fixe is a technical term in music. A disambiguation page could be used for the usages, but there is no page at present for the musical usage. I suppose you could draw an analogy with the mental aberration on the basis that the musical theme is continually returned to, but musically it is not so much an obsession with the theme as a use to represent a certain character as in Peter and the Wolf. John R. Brews 14:48, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
But which came first, and is one derived from the other? Peter Jackson 10:23, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

The use in literature goes a long way back, and I'd guess predates the musical usage, apparently which began with Berlioz as you mention as an example. It also is called a leitmotif apparently. See this. This term also shows up as a device used in poetry. However, I've made no attempt to look into the history of the musical usage. John R. Brews 13:33, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

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